That's not a pretty bad price for the 360; I think that's pretty reasonable.

I'm with the folks who are somewhat sick and tired of hearing all the complaints on whether or not Xbox 360 is a gaming machine or not. Besides the horrendous MTV styled ad campaign by Microsoft, the machine looks pretty good and its 3rd party support seems top notch (worlds better than the current Gamecube 3rd party support and even better than the old Xbox 3rd party support)


I find it funny that the console would be scant $50 more expensive than the outrageously priced PSP which goes for $250 (or closer to $300 if you add taxes).

Not to bash PSP or anything since I'm going to get the PSP when its price drops a hundred bucks or so.

Dont forget to buy the U$1000 HD TV to enjoy full the nice graphics of 360.

The thing is, they lost money on the original Xbox; and they will lose money on this one, too. Games are traditionally what bring in profit, and those are getting more and more expensive to produce -- meaning that even if they get the same sales numbers, the very few profitable games will be pulling in slimmer profits than in the past. If they don't get enough non-gamers on board, will they still be making much of a profit at all? The question becomes: how long do you invest money and resources in something that is only causing you losses?

They are banking on getting non-gamers in, and getting them in droves, not only to make up the money difference, but as part of their corporate mission. It's not a hard fact to see. It's inbetween the lines and it's there, explicitly, in the lines themselves, and it's been there from the very inception of the Xbox. It's just easy to forget when you are a gamer that they might not be talking to you.

A "gamer" is merely the sort of person who bought the original Xbox, whether for Halo, Madden, or Panzer Dragoon Orta. I'm sure that person will probably buy the 360 as well. It will sell to gamers, just like the original Xbox did; either in higher or lower proportions. Microsoft is trying to expand the market with this console; they are explicitly reaching for the "non-gamer". A non-gamer is quite simply someone who doesn't own a video game console and who doesn't play videogames. Take a look outside; there are lots of them. More than those of us who do. And Microsoft is pushing to attract those people. You need look no further than the Time Magazine interview with Bill Gates, where he explicitly states that this console is neither primarily a gaming console, and nor is it marketed towards gamers. It's instead envisioned and marketed as a powerful content delivery platform for casual tech users. This doesn't necessarily mean that they are leaving gamers behind or anything, merely that we aren't in their focus right now. They know that we will buy their console, because that's what we do. They aren't worried about us. The focus is elsewhere.

So yeah. I think it will be a hard sell. Partly because the Xbox name is still identified with being a gaming console, and all the MTV specials in the world won't change that. But my big concern is that it will be difficult to convince the non-gamer that he needs (or even wants) this box. The only thing that sets it apart from a computer is that it's specifically designed for playing games, and that it's a little cheaper; but the non gamer in most cases already has a computer, and doesn't have much interest in playing video games. So why would she want to buy one? Why put down over $300 for a box of redundant functionality that's tethered to the TV in her living room? I think it will be a tough sell, and I worry that they won't know how to market to that diverse and diffuse demographic. It will be interesting to see what happens, either way.

As for myself, I don't intend on buying one because, as I see it, 90% of gaming merchandise is horribly overpriced for the experience you end up getting (especially in this case; the common theme has been repackaged versions of older games that I never had any interest in to begin with, with minor graphical improvements that you can only really notice with an HDTV; and I sure as hell can't afford one of those right now). I'll probably buy one after the price drops a few times and I start seeing some software that gets me excited about it. Elder Scrolls IV is the only game that looks interesting and I won't really have time to get into it; RPG's kind of make miserable these days anyway. But this isn't about you or me, or anyone else who reads gamesarefun.com. Microsoft (and Sony, at least based on their rhetoric so far) is aiming for the mainstream. All I'm saying is that I worry that they are overestimating the willingless of your average, non-gaming consumer to buy into their rhetoric. You might say that I'm making a lot presumptions about the behavior of a non-gamer; but Microsoft is making just as many. You can't go into business like this without making presumptions, after all. But look at it this way: they expect gaming's audience to reach 1 billion people in this generation. Those extra 8 billion people don't just come from nowhere.

Anyway, if I'm wrong then I'm wrong. I don't possess any crystal ball into the essence of human nature or the workings of consumer psychology. I'm just expressing my concerns from my perspective and my experiences. At the end of the day, what happens with the Xbox360, the PS3, or the Revolution doesn't really affect me one way or another. I'll just have more time to fill out my Genesis collection.

andonuts-I want you to know something.

You win my absolute moron of the day award. Mainly for

1)Making a whole lot of presumptions

2)Thinking that it wont sell. The Xbox sold, why not the 360?

"Try supporting a family, paying a mortgage and a car payment, etc., and tell me how easy it is to just go to the store and say "you know what, $300 is nothing...lets buy an Xbox 360.""

Where are you going with this? Plenty of people are able to do all of the above, including myself.

What you're all forgetting is that $300 now is not nearly what it was ten years ago when the Playstation ($300) and Saturn ($400) launched. I think we're all getting a deal.

Ah, but is that 300$ for a 360 without the hard drive or other additions? Remember that the Xbox lost 100$ a system (with the hard drive) when it sold for 300$, now Xboxs lose like 250$ per sale. I wonder...

proppat, I know $300 isn't easy for everyone. Mainly it's younger people who can't get every console, and thus incite console flames at places like GameFAQs.

I'm in college myself, and I wasn't able to buy all three current consoles for a couple of years, but I still did it.

Anyway, why is 1 billion ludicrous? He never put a timeframe on the thing. Reaching as many people as possible with a hobby we all enjoy is an admirable goal, as opposed to simply grooming cornered markets.

terpfen, I have a nice, professional job thanks. I can afford $300 if I want. But I'm also single and have a good job I got through a college education. $300 isn't so easy for everyone. If you think it is, you need to pull your gold plated thumb out of your ass. My comment was that 1 billion consumers is just a ludicrous figure...and that many people in 1st world countries with jobs can barely afford $300. Try supporting a family, paying a mortgage and a car payment, etc., and tell me how easy it is to just go to the store and say "you know what, $300 is nothing...lets buy an Xbox 360." Videogames aren't the top priority in life for most...

Actually I'm hearing that Nintendo is considering throwing DVD and possibly even next-gen DVD movie playback into thier Revolution. They don't seem to have made up thier minds though.

Basic multi-functionality is pretty much a proven concept that dates back pretty far. The contrevery isn't whether people are more willing to buy a product if it does multiple things, but rather, how many features you can throw into a product before it becomes too complicated for a normal person to easily use.

I think Cell-phone have hit that point in the past few years and are only getting worse. Consoles however, are another story, as the current generation of consoles really only have basic multi-functionality. The next generation consoles look to be going a few steps further, but really we don't have a good idea just how far they're going to go.

proppat, uh... those of us with jobs can afford $300. $300 is nothing.

proppat, interesting that you say "All I want to do is make a phone call" with a cell phone or "The mainstream wants something small and simple that does what it's supposed to do." Didn't we just see an article saying that the PS3 was not "made for gaming"? And hasn't MS often talked about their next system being a all in one media center or something like that? It seems both those partys are going to sell their systems on multiple features, 360 more on gaming than ps3 (by Sony's comments). All we have heard about the Rev points to just gaming. Do people want features or substance? We will see what they want by sales, I believe. Features add to value and justify purchase, but by how much? And will people pay more money for features they may or may not want? Interesting buisness subject. I believe xbox will sell for the reason of it being there first/hype/graphics. ps3 will sell due to SHM/graphics/fanboyism. rev will sell due to possible low price/innovation/fanboyism. 300 won't be bad. Im predicting (and hoping for) a $299 price tag. 350 wouldn't hit a billion. They have a better chance with 300 even. woot.

er, "of course you want to buy something easy to use," is what I meant to type. I really need to learn to proof-read my entries before hitting the submit butten.

sorry.

I don't know Omega, I hear the exact opposite. People are always complaining about how things are so difficult. My mom, for example, constantly complains about technology. Her cell phone? "Why does it have a camera? Why is this so complicated? All I want to do is make a phone call."

The mainstream wants something small and simple that does what it's supposed to do. The nerd crowd wants something that does everything. The young crowd is a split. They want something that does multiple things, but only if it does them all well.

Stop trolling around Burroughs! Sh*t, Blkstarr said "Hell, god has barely touched 1 billion people worldwide...". I'm sure he meant god hasn't touched more than 2.1 billion...since thats a pretty recent count of Christians worldwide. So...in that case, maybe Gates does have a chance....


$300-400 is an affordable price for a console. As always though, you can count on the $50 price drops every 6 months or so.

Halo 3 when PS3 comes out: Possible? Yes. Would I like to see it then? No. Besides...if that happened, I'd never get a chance to play whatever comes out for the PS3 launch!

so, am I allowed to comment on all the XBox bashing or will I be considered a troll again?

Cell phones and computers have practical reasons to purchase in ADDITION to playing games. What else does a console have besides that which could enhance your life like no other device can? MP3, HD, all that extra frilly crap can be found elsewhere and with better support. The situations are completely compatible.

J. Allard is a retard. I miss Shamus. At least he could sell the damn XBOX. But we'll see how this goes. I mean its Dreamcast all over again. We'll see if Microsoft can pull this off. I also expect the X360 to sell for about $349.99. Lets just hope it has the same amount of quality games as the Dreamcast.

Not suprised that they're talking about it costing *in the range of 300 dollars.* I wouldn't expect them to sell it for anything more.

As for 1 billion gamers, well I'm sure if you count every console ever sold since the Atari-Days we've gotten pretty close already. But 1 billion people owning the XB360? No way in heck.

What, the People's Republic Box?

One billion gamers means that one 1 out of every 6.5 people on earth will be a gamer. Seeing that a $300 game system is out of reach for half the worlds population (heck, that's expensive in the US and we're sitting high and mighty), that's pretty much the same as saying MS's goal is to make 1:3 people who could feasably afford this system will play it. That's just rediculous. A decent amount of people in first world countries don't even have tv's.